[glampka]

Today we mourn the passing of a beloved old friend, Common Sense, who has been with us for many years. No one knows for sure how old he was, since his birth records were long ago lost in bureaucratic red tape. He will be remembered as having cultivated such valuable lessons as:
Knowing when to come in out of the rain;
Why the early bird gets the worm;
Life isn't always fair;and Maybe it was my fault.

Common Sense lived by simple, sound financial policies:
(don't spend more than you can earn) and reliable strategies:
(adults, not children, are in charge).

His health began to deteriorate rapidly when well-intentioned but overbearing regulations were set in place. Reports of a 6 -year- old boy charged with sexual harassment for kissing a classmate; teens suspended from school for using mouthwash after lunch; and a teacher fired for reprimanding an unruly student, only worsened his condition.

Common Sense lost ground when parents attacked teachers for doing the job that they themselves had failed to do in disciplining their unruly children. It declined even further when schools were required to get parental consent to administer Tylenol, sun lotion or a band-aid to a student; but could not inform parents when a student became pregnant and
wanted to have an abortion.

Common Sense lost the will to live as the Ten Commandments became contraband; churches became businesses; and criminals received better treatment than their victims.

Common Sense took a beating when you couldn't defend yourself from a burglar in your own home and the burglar could sue you for assault.

Common Sense finally gave up the will to live, after a woman failed to realize that a steaming cup of coffee was hot. She spilled a little in her lap, and was promptly awarded a huge settlement. Common Sense was preceded in death by his parents, Truth and Trust; his wife, Discretion; his daughter, Responsibility; and his son, Reason.

He is survived by his 3 stepbrothers; I Know My Rights, Someone Else Is To Blame, and I'm A Victim.

Not many attended his funeral because so few realized he was gone.

[pogodzib]

I thought Common Sense passed away years ago.

[e_baer]

i completely agree with every little bit that was written. honestly, it is so bad here in NJ, that is why i want to get out of here so bad!

also, about the kids misbehaving, it is absolutely true! I work at an after school program called kid care, and the kids are horrible some of them. the language from a first grader!!!! i can truely say that i wish we were allowed to give them spankings! there would be about 50 out of 80 kids that would have sore bottoms at the end of the day.

That is yet another thing i loved about israel, everyone used common sense. I guess thats what happens when you are constantly at war, and every one has served in the military for 2-3 years.

I think that would be a wonderful thing that America sets in. To make every child that gets out of highschool to server in the military for at least 2 years.

[jimw369]

Integrity presided over the funeral. Thanks Glampka. Already got this one tucked away for future use.

[thelastmucci]

I agree 100% with Both Elliott and Gary. I think it would be a tremendous benefit if this country had mandatory military service. I also agree with Gary about the Death of Common Sense and the albeit extinction of responsibility. When I was younger I got into some scuffles in HS..however we used fists not weapons to settle our diffrences. Now in the same High School there is a posted Police Officer and the rate in which weapons are used is staggering. I've also come to the conclusion that this country has lost her sense of Patriotism. I'm taking a class in college called "America's experience in Vietnam" and while I'm justifibly biased I am shocked at the lack of understnading of not only the students but the teacher as well. Saying we "should have stayed out of the cold war" and some of the students agreeing with communism and socialism frightens me. The teacher is no better while her father served in The Nam she is/has become completely one sided in her lectures regarding Vietnam and the current War we are facing. On top of all that there is an Air Force Reservist who is in the class and he denounces the very govt he works for. It's a shame really....I'm not saying you have to support everything your country has done/is doing but show some faith at least.

[jimw369]

It is all about moral decay stemming from the breakdown of the family as it was set up to be. (UHOH)

Dont worry. I will not say anymore.

[rlcline76]

Mucci, you really do not want my perspective on communism or socialism...I have 2 degrees with a focus on revolutionary Europe. I have also spent a lot of time studying Vietnam and Uncle Ho.

Yes Jim, you do not need to say anything else, you already know what happens when you get wound up! LOL That is not a warning, that was a joke.

[pogodzib]

Just curious Becky, what do you do with two degrees with a focus on revolutionary Europe? Teach or politics?

[rlcline76]

Neither. If I wasn't where I am currently sitting, I would be more than likely working in a library. Our last duty station, I worked at the Department of Energy as a librarian. Historians know how to find the answer, which puts us in a good position to work in research libraries (It's all the archives experience and it helped that I had already worked in a law library). Nice set up and several perks. Trained at the Library of Congress. If I got bored, I could walk across the Mall and do something at the Smithsonian library and spend my lunch break sitting at the National Gallery sitting in front of the huge painting of Napolean Bonaparte. It's my favorite.

[rlcline76]

Oh, and I taught while I was getting my MS...I hated it.

[pogodzib]

Librarians and Historians both make sense, although back in the day when i was a "student supervisor" at a library during college I learned how to find the best books without actually open them to learn anything. That just wouldn't have made any sense to actually read what I was recommending others to read.

[jimw369]

Originally Posted by rlcline76

Mucci, you really do not want my perspective on communism or socialism...I have 2 degrees with a focus on revolutionary Europe. I have also spent a lot of time studying Vietnam and Uncle Ho.

Yes Jim, you do not need to say anything else, you already know what happens when you get wound up! LOL That is not a warning, that was a joke.

I knew you werent just another pretty face. Its your brains everybody is after.

[rlcline76]

LOL
It is hard to say how many dates I've had just because I can hold my own when having a discussion about Nikita Khruschev and Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn while intoxicated.

[dfurbee]

I have to disagree with mandatory military service!! War is an unnecesary thing, brought about and started by idiots!! I do not believe in war and will not have my son serve time in a sensless thing! Why should we die like that? Is not life too short anyway? Sorry to disagree, but war is nothing but idiotic! IMHO...WWJD??

Originally Posted by thelastmucci

I agree 100% with Both Elliott and Gary. I think it would be a tremendous benefit if this country had mandatory military service. I also agree with Gary about the Death of Common Sense and the albeit extinction of responsibility. When I was younger I got into some scuffles in HS..however we used fists not weapons to settle our diffrences. Now in the same High School there is a posted Police Officer and the rate in which weapons are used is staggering. I've also come to the conclusion that this country has lost her sense of Patriotism. I'm taking a class in college called "America's experience in Vietnam" and while I'm justifibly biased I am shocked at the lack of understnading of not only the students but the teacher as well. Saying we "should have stayed out of the cold war" and some of the students agreeing with communism and socialism frightens me. The teacher is no better while her father served in The Nam she is/has become completely one sided in her lectures regarding Vietnam and the current War we are facing. On top of all that there is an Air Force Reservist who is in the class and he denounces the very govt he works for. It's a shame really....I'm not saying you have to support everything your country has done/is doing but show some faith at least.

[thelastmucci]

Ahhh yes but aren't certain wars traced back to Catholic (and I'm catholic) roots (ie the crusades) would you say those people were idiotic. I'm not saying war is good....however I do think it is a necessary evil. If war didn't happen then the world would be in either a)a complete socialistic state b) complete anarchy c) a little of both. What gets me is the people that call the war stupid and at the same time watches "continuing coverage" on all the news outlets. Why doesn't the news ever post anything good about the war...about the Marine (and I'm not being biased I'm going from heresay) making peace with the Iraqi people. Or better still building schools and hospitals. *sigh* I digress though, I'm afraid Patriotism is dead and buried and we won't be seeing Her for a very long time.

PS Becky I would love to talk about Vietnam and the communist part of it as soon as I learn a little more to hold my own. Don't get me wrong I really don't think that the US learned anything from the French after the had there butts handed to them (and footing the bill mind you) but I do believe in the good intentions that the USA had. Then again the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

Night all.

[jvharding]

Jesus was crucified, died and was buried, but he rose again! If we all just use some common sense it could rise again! I am a believer in God and my Country.

I am a a Patriot that believes in people can make the change. Perseverance and determination Win.

Here I thought you were Passing out Common Sense Gary

[e_baer]

Originally Posted by dfurbee

I have to disagree with mandatory military service!! War is an unnecesary thing, brought about and started by idiots!! I do not believe in war and will not have my son serve time in a sensless thing! Why should we die like that? Is not life too short anyway? Sorry to disagree, but war is nothing but idiotic! IMHO...WWJD??

In ways i agree with you, but then look at hitler, saddam, the khmar rouge, mongole empire, japan attacked pearl harbor, just to name a few. think if these things went un punished and paid no attention to, we would be in a bad place. where would we, as a nation, stand?

would we be able to keep this exhilerating hobby of reef tanks?
would we have any of the freedoms we have now?

if there was a draft, i would go in a heart beat.

If there was mandetory service, i wouldnt mind at all, i think in would be e awseom and amazing for everyone to learn some realities in life, and i guarentee, it would change the mind set of a lot of people who think the world revolves around them.

When i was mentioning about israel, not all see combat, in fact, most dont.

[thelastmucci]

Originally Posted by e_baer

I

if there was a draft, i would go in a heart beat.

You know Elliott if you feel that stongly you could always enlist. I think I've read that you have some college so you could even to to OCS (officer Candidate School) and come out a boot LT. Please don't take this the wrong way anyone I am in no way promoting of glamorinzing the service it just makes me proud to see someone say if there was a draft he wouldn't try to get out of it.

[glampka]

Originally Posted by thelastmucci

You know Elliott if you feel that stongly you could always enlist.

The last thing we need is Elliot running around with a gun given his electrical experiences! He'd probably shoot himself!

[rlcline76]

Deb, you'll hate me for this. I believe in the draft although, I discourage people from enlisting these days especially under vague concepts like: "I want to do what is right for my country." Technically, if you want to do what is right for the country, might want to get a degree in chemistry...we are always looking to construct the perfect weapon.

No, I have too many people around me who can easily shrug off what I go through when I have a family member deploys. Most of those people have girls who are not affected by the current mess and can easily stop reading the papers and turn off the news. There is work for women in the military, and not necessarily front line stuff. Toss them into support positions and free up the guys so that they could fight.

Gary, I'm not posting on this thread anymore. I can just see someone getting in trouble. It is already getting heated.

[pogodzib]

War is one of those evils that will always exist, but I don't feel that mandatory service is the answer. If any situation gets bad enough, people will enlist on their own to help fix the problem. Granted, some people are slower to step up then others either because they do not feel that the problem needs fixing yet or is justified, but eventually most people will do what is right and what they feel is necessary. Fighting a war because we are attacked or are in eminent danger is one thing, fighting a war to get rid of someone that is in power because they may cause a threat in the future is a totally different thing. How many times will it take for the people in power getting involved in things that they either don't understand or should stay out of in the first place before the entire word hates us? How many times are we going to go to war to eliminate some evil only to have the hatred toward us grow or have the new person that gets put into power not be any less evil than the previous person? Am I willing to volunteer to fight a war to protect our county and our youth's future - yes, without thinking twice about it. Am I willing to give up 2-3 years of my life to go through the military to learn how to kill other people and keep myself alive just incase someone in power decides that we don't like someone that is in power in another country on the other side of the world- no.

BTW - I feel very strongly that we are all smart enough to make our own decisions and shouldn't get told what we need to do to protect ourselves from ourselves, whether it be military service, bucking up, smoking cigarettes or pot, etc...

[jimw369]

I cant find anything on WWM about this topic? Were we not talking about a great post from Glampka? We need to stay off of Polotics and Religion! Nobody is going to change some one elses mind about these on a fish site.

Besides we are putting our new moderator in an awkward position. Some of these people that post in these threads have become (in a wierd way) like family (even you Tonz).

If anyone wants to argue find some one giving just plain bad advice on saltwater topics and we will take out some frustration there.

[pogodzib]

I do agree that nobody here is probably going to change anyone's opinions on the topics being discussed and agree that this thread should get back on topic, but this is "The Lobby", which generally isn't necessary reef related. With that said and even though the thread got off topic, I haven't seen any bashing of on another, just varying opinions so I think this thread can remain open but lets keep it clean and play nice.

[e_baer]

Originally Posted by thelastmucci

You know Elliott if you feel that stongly you could always enlist. I think I've read that you have some college so you could even to to OCS (officer Candidate School) and come out a boot LT. Please don't take this the wrong way anyone I am in no way promoting of glamorinzing the service it just makes me proud to see someone say if there was a draft he wouldn't try to get out of it.

thanks. I was actually strongly considering joining the military just to get my training to fly aircraft, but then with the whole situation going on in iraq....

Originally Posted by glampka

The last thing we need is Elliot running around with a gun given his electrical experiences! He'd probably shoot himself!

well, i have shot before, and yes, i am still alive and un injured. lol


and now back onto topic...


SOOOOO, how about that common sense!

[lynnvangsnes]

Gary, strange how your initial post turned into a discussion on war.