[kgh9555]

I am having a major problem with fish dyeing. Let me start off with tank info. 150 gallon tank, 180 lbs of live rock, 3 inch sand and crush coral base, bio ball filter system, 2 Korallia 860 GPM power heads, Protein Skimmer, and heater. 2 clown fish, 1 fire fish, 1 yellow faced angel, 1 Whip Pink Fairy Wrasse, 1 Chimos, 1 Hipo, 2 cleaner Shrimp, 20 blue hermit and 10 snails, 1 Foxface Tang, Star Fish (cleaner), 1 unicorn Tang, 1 yellow eye tang, 1 Neon Dotty Back and 1 trumpet coral. The tank is about 9 months old and all has been going well until recently.

I added the Fox face and unicorn tang 2 months ago. The unicorn tang died in 3 weeks. Went back to the store and they gave me another unicorn tang and purchased a yellow eyed tang. The Neon Dotty back died a week ago. I did a 25% water change even though the water tested great. The yellow eyed died after the Dotty back. I noticed that the fox face had ich. The store sold me Ich Attach which is 100% organic and I did not have to remove the fish. Water still tests great. This morning, I fed the fish and the fox face still had ich but not as much. I gave another treatment of the Ich Attack. Tonight, the unicorn was swimming sideways and the fox face was being held against one of the power heads. I removed both fish and place in the quarantine tank. The fox face is covered with Ich. All the other fish seem to be OK; however the clown fish had been hiding in the rock lately. When I removed the 2 wish, the clowns came out and started swimming like they normally did. I did not notice any fighting in the tank. This is very frustrating. I am down to the shrimp, 2 clown fish, hipo, chimos, Wrasse and fire fish. It seems that newer fish have died and the original fish are doing fine, except for the dotty back which recently died. I clean the tank on a regular basis. I have been getting brown film on the glass which cleans off with little effort. I do not u se any cleaners on the glass at all and it is covered. The only new change was the Christmas tree which is about 4 feet from the tank. What am I doing wrong, this getting frustrating?

[RyanG]

Ken, can you list your water parameters?

[kgh9555]

Sure:
Ammonia (NH3.NH+4) =0 ppm, Nitrite (no2) + o ppm, Nitrate (NO3) = o ppm, PH = 8.4, Salinity = 1.23, Temp = 78 F. Last water change was 25% a little over a week ago and at that time I had the same parameters.

So far all the remaining fish are ok. No signs of ich on any of them. The clown fish are swiming around normally and not hiding. The only thing I have NOT done as of yet is a bio ball cleaning.

Look forward to all the assistance from some great people. I also placed a recent photo in my profile.

[pogodzib]

First off, I you want to truly get the ich out of the system, you should remove ALL of the fish out of the DT and leave it fallow for 6 weeks. Leaving just one fish in your DT gives the ich a host so even if the fish doesn't display any signs of ich, the ich parasite will remain present. Once the other fish are put back in there, they may get ich again since their was a host fish present. There is no reef safe medicine for ich. Garlic will help a fish by building up its immune system, but don't put anything else in a reef tank to treat for ich. They either won't kill the fish or will harm your corals or inverts.

Now of the fish dying issue. The first month or two of the fish being in a tank is the time when the fish are the most stressed out and prone to diseases or issues due to water quality problems. Once a fish has been in the system longer, it gets adjusted to the water parameters and recovers from the stress caused from shipping. The main things that I always look for after a new fish has died is 1.) was it weak from shipping 2.) sick or diseased 3.) picked on by other fish 4.) how are the water parameters. These are usually the primary causes for a new fish dying. Since you've had multiple fish die, I'd eliminate issue #1. You've had some larger/more bold types of fish die and usually you won't get fish that will pick on every species of new fish so I'd also eliminate #3. That leave items #2 and 4. You've already said that you have ich and some of your fish that died are very prone to ich so they may have died of ich without you seeing the ich on the fish. Sometimes you need to look at the fish from the correct angle to see how much ich is really on the fish. Another thought is that your fish may not have ich, but velvet or some other disease. Ich is the most common and has larger spots, but velvet can have similar spots, only smaller. The other issue is water quality. Bioballs+Crushed Coral usually = Nitrates. I know that you have been getting 0ppm with your test kits, but have you tried a second set of test with a different brand of test kit to see if they say zero as well?

[Waterlogged]

Originally Posted by pogodzib

First off, I you want to truly get the ich out of the system, you should remove ALL of the fish out of the DT and leave it fallow for 6 weeks. Leaving just one fish in your DT gives the ich a host so even if the fish doesn't display any signs of ich, the ich parasite will remain present. Once the other fish are put back in there, they may get ich again since their was a host fish present. There is no reef safe medicine for ich. Garlic will help a fish by building up its immune system, but don't put anything else in a reef tank to treat for ich. They either won't kill the fish or will harm your corals or inverts.

Now of the fish dying issue. The first month or two of the fish being in a tank is the time when the fish are the most stressed out and prone to diseases or issues due to water quality problems. Once a fish has been in the system longer, it gets adjusted to the water parameters and recovers from the stress caused from shipping. The main things that I always look for after a new fish has died is 1.) was it weak from shipping 2.) sick or diseased 3.) picked on by other fish 4.) how are the water parameters. These are usually the primary causes for a new fish dying. Since you've had multiple fish die, I'd eliminate issue #1. You've had some larger/more bold types of fish die and usually you won't get fish that will pick on every species of new fish so I'd also eliminate #3. That leave items #2 and 4. You've already said that you have ich and some of your fish that died are very prone to ich so they may have died of ich without you seeing the ich on the fish. Sometimes you need to look at the fish from the correct angle to see how much ich is really on the fish. Another thought is that your fish may not have ich, but velvet or some other disease. Ich is the most common and has larger spots, but velvet can have similar spots, only smaller. The other issue is water quality. Bioballs+Crushed Coral usually = Nitrates. I know that you have been getting 0ppm with your test kits, but have you tried a second set of test with a different brand of test kit to see if they say zero as well?

If it is velvet, will leaving the DT fallow for 6 weeks eliminate it from DT?

[kgh9555]

Thanks waterlogged. Yes I have tried another test kit and also had my LPS check the water. All is ok with the water. What does the garlic do? Do I place it in the tank or my sump? I did read up on ich and the type of fish I had are very prone to ich. How ever, it is very strange how all the original I had are now acting normal and NOT hiding. Maybe there was some kind of attach I did not see. I have to clean out the QT since I placed the fish in there that died. The foxface was the one covered with what looked liked ich or, as yo mentioned velvit. I was also thinking that maybe I got a bad patch of water from the LPS. They get it direct from the ocean. I just finished insatlling an RO/DI system, just about 30 minutes ago. I checked the water and much to my surprise all parameters are great except for the ammonia which was off the chart. I thought the RO/DI system would give me as close to 100% acceptable water. Do I have add an ammonia remover even with a DI/RO system? I nany case, I am planning on a water change this weekend.

[plecosword]

I have a question, if and ich atack happens like this, would it be a good idea to use a UV eteriolizer? IT would kill all the ick but also the good bacteria.

[dinor2]

I am still fairly new at this hobby but haven't read this in any posts here yet, how old is your tank again? What I am thinking is maybe you need to not add anymore fish to your tank for a while because maybe what happened was your bacteria in the water did not have enough time to adjust to the new livestock and that will definitly cause fish stress which can lead to disease.... Again, I'm new but I have discovered that testing kits do have an expiration date (I know yours are fine, just mentioned this to make a point!) red cyano can happen to ANYONE and, it takes at least 4 months to have a good, healthy amount of pods flourish in your tank. My point is that I really believe maybe your tank needed more time at the beginning OR just more time in between fish additions....

But like I said, I'm still fairly new to saltwater (did the freshwater for 13 years) and I'm sure you'll get more experienced posts to help with solutions.

Good luck with your tank, don't give up, there is a solution!

Dana

[kgh9555]

I wonder if this could be be my problem.

My LFS get their water directly from the ocean. I did not have this problem until I did a major water change. My fish are dying off one by one. I just learned that RED TIDE is an issue on our area. I found this out from a freind and confirmed it on the State of Florida Fish and Wildlife Instututes Web page. I called the LFS and they said they are not aware of issue with Red Tide nor do they have a test for it. They suggested another water change. DAAAA, why would get the water from them when there is a posting of Red Tide in the area and they don;t even know about it. I just installed an RO/DI unit in my house but the ammonia levels are very high, all other parameters are great. I am going to try adding Ammonia remover and mix the salt myself and try that. This is making much more sense to me if the red tide is an issue. What does anyone else think.

[dinor2]

I have always used ro/di water by the gallon from Wal Mart and have not had any issues with it. It's cheap and all I do is add Amquel and salt. I honestly do not trust 'fresh' saltwater since I don't know how old it is or how it was stored/shipped but that's just what I think! I may be a control freak, not sure!

[dinor2]

Kenneth,

How's the tank going?....

[rlcline76]

Hmmm, what test kit are you using?